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Forum upgrade - Bad news (and possibly good news)


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MacroMan!
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Hi everyone.

Some bad news regarding the forum upgrade that was planned (and in action). Due to several technical difficulties, it is not possible to 'upgrade' the forum (ie, new forum software, but with the same posts).

However, they may be some good news on the horizon. I can't really say much, but we may have new forum software on the way. Basically, when AHK v2 becomes mainstream and _l and Basic fall behind, most of the scripts/data in the forum will no longer be relevant to an extent. So the initial idea is to have a brand new forum for AHK v2. When AHK v1 becomes old/obsolete, the current forum can be archived for future viewing.

I will have more news when it becomes available.

David
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IsNull
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Due to several technical difficulties, it is not possible to 'upgrade' the forum

Which are...?

I've updated several PHPbb Forums (included modified versions where you have to do it by hand), and we have here lot of people with even more experience in web development. This said, are you sure it is not possible (in acceptable time horizont)?

Actually, the only thing to do is to transform the database tables to the new format, and update some ids.

So please explain your problems :)

MacroMan!
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The main upgrade script fails because of Chinese (or japanese or korean or somthing) characters in a post. I've only been able to pinpoint this down to 6000 or so posts. I tried looking for the post manually and also tried a regex search but was unable to find it after several days of searching. On top of that there are about 30 or so custom code changes (some of them are huge) which will need many days, if not weeks, work porting them over. I have documented them, but not done any work re-implementing them. Believe me, I have spent more than just a few evenings looking at code.

You sound like you have more experience at this than me, so if you still believe it is possible and would like to collaborate, then please offer your assistance. Just PM me and I'll let you know all you need to know.

Even if an upgrade is possible, it would still take a lot less time to install a new forum that will only contain data relevant to the current/next release of AHK (v2), which hugely breaks current scripts. After all, when v2 becomes mainstream and people stop using _l and basic a lot less, almost all of the data in the scripts and functions and ask for help forums will contain incorrect data. This old data can of course be archived for future viewing. Anyway, this idea is still in very early thinking stages and no work as yet been planned/started.

David
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tank
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Which are...?

exactly there are numerous highly skillled we developers as part of this community. In addition to some supurb dba's. I am aware that one issue may be the change in database schema but this can be over come. I am certain given a sampling of data to test that I could under a day

current forum can be archived for future viewing.

Not sure what you mean by archived but many may choose to use obsolete versions. I am sure those that work in enterprise environments understand. The current forum should be labeled depricated but left alone perhaps a folder move at best.
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MacroMan!
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By archive, I just meant move it out of the limelight, but will still be accessible in it's current form (including url location) for people to view/post should they still be using AHK v1.

ie, the main forum link will point to the new one, but there will be a link to the old stating it is for the older version of AHK. Maybe a text header at the top of each page in the old forum stating its for the AHK v1, with a link to the new forum.

Just throwing some idea's out there.

David
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SoLong&Thx4AllTheFish
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... archive ... will still be accessible in it's current form for people to view/post should they still be using AHK v1.

Thanks

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Due to several technical difficulties, it is not possible to 'upgrade' the forum (ie, new forum software, but with the same posts).

...omg, this was exactly my fear, someone would TRY to upgrade the forum, fail, then give up...& have a blank forum.

I don't know what to say, except, I'd like to be involved in figuring this out. I really don't wanna start with a fresh forum...or would it be a partial upgrade? Like keep (import) the memberlist? If I had access to the DB & was able to test things, I'd love to see if I can help.

I really think Chinese chars in 6000 posts would be correctable, dumb the db, run sed (or something) over the file to remove "weird chars", then re-import that DB & try upgrading again.

Can you post a screenshot or more info on this upgrade script failure?...like the exact error msg.

Can you re-create the error by making a new phpBB2 forum, typing weird chars in a post, then trying to upgrade that to phpBB3?

I understand the posts from V1 might be obsolete when V2 comes out, but that could be handled by moving posts to a "V1" forum/category.

Please don't give up, let others tackle this problem, before we settle on a blank forum.

MacroMan!
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It doesn't have to be a blank forum, I could do a partial upgrade. Like the user table, the general chat section etc. In fact the problem actually lies somewhere in the Ask for Help section about 3-4 years ago. So this section could be truncated back to 2 years or something and the rest kept. (Possible to archive the older posts into some kind of other db viewer.)

The upgrade fails on the copying data section when it gets to that block of 6000 posts, the same place every time I attempt an upgrade. Just loads a blank screen. This even happens on a local machine upgrade. I don't believe this would be a problem if there was a php script that could be run from shell, but alas, there isn't.

I'll attempt the upgrade again tonight and report back with further details of what goes wrong.

I am still willing to do an upgrade if it's a possibility. (Even if I do a new forum, it will, at the very least, include the user's table, so existing logins shall remain.)

David
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guest3456
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By archive, I just meant move it out of the limelight, but will still be accessible in it's current form (including url location) for people to view/post should they still be using AHK v1.


good. its necessary to still be able to discuss v1, i imagine many people will be slow to upgrade

jaco0646
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...that block of 6000 posts, the same place every time...

Sounds easily testable by selectively removing some of those 6k to narrow it down. Worse comes to worse, that's less than 2% of the forum. Delete them all and then upgrade.

fragman
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Personally, I deem the Scripts and Functions forum the most important one, as long as this forum is convertible it should be acceptable. I'm not sure if posts from the Ask For Help forum of this age are really needed anymore.

AzAxeman
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I've run into this problem before on some of my websites. Here's what I did to correct it.

Basically I made a replica of my current forum databases on my local server, then I did a local install of the new phpbb forums, I did a comparison between the two, then I made any changes to table structure/format in the current forum db manually.

This allowed me to do the export to the new format, and then upload a new db with the correct format for the forum upgrade.

It's long and tedious, but it works (at least for me it worked) your mileage may vary.

Cheers
AHK newbie

Frankie
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MacroMan!
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Thanks for the post, I will try that to see if it works.

If not, I will just trim the posts from 4 years back.

David
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IsNull
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Basically I made a replica of my current forum databases on my local server, then I did a local install of the new phpbb forums, I did a comparison between the two, then I made any changes to table structure/format in the current forum db manually.

Exactly. As long as we have an database "interface" to deal with, you don't have to rely on the automatic forum updater script provided by phpbb.

About archive:

I would simply create two new sections in this Forum (labeled AHK v2 Functions / Help). If I look at the community and the very slow process migrating at AHK_L (which is mostly backwards compatible to AHK Basic) it will take years after the offical release of AHK v2 when AHK_L/AHK Basic will get "Obsolete". There may be several scripts which are to big to simply update, there might be some in use for companys and rewrite is not always possible in the meaning: never touch running code. This actually counts in enterprise environments more than for the fun coders.

jm2c.

@MacroMan! Thank you for not giving up -> you are in a great and knowledgeable community, never forget that :)

If not, I will just trim the posts from 4 years back.

I'm sure we can figure out whats going wrong, and in the worst case we can just strip the bad postings out.
Loosing the last 4years doesn't sound that good :)

If you don't get it, you should create a simple test scenario (20 Postings which wont migrate) and then we can debug the updater script and fix/encode/replace problematic parts.
The test-scenario Db-Dump + phpbb Forum can then be given to anyone here which is willing to help.