Google Captcha Terror

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Re: Google Captcha Terror

11 Feb 2017, 16:34

Since it's reliably happening to you and your wife.. and no one else...
What do you have in common?
Router / network / firewall / scripts / etc

In your expert opinion what number of cookies would not be "a ridiculous number"? /s ;)
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

12 Feb 2017, 19:24

How do you know it's not happening to anyone else? We share the same router and the same kind of browser (Pale Moon). Regarding cookie numbers your question is redundant - I already explained that this site uses two to three times more cookies than other sites - so why don't you explain what they all do?
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tank
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

13 Feb 2017, 18:08

I noticed recently using Chromium (the open source version of chrome) i get google captchas alot. You have mentioned extensions you have and i am betting at least one of them is to blame or your using other than the most standard of browsers.
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Drugwash
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

14 Feb 2017, 04:06

I'm using Pale Moon too (25.8.1, oldish version) with a ton of extensions and I never get captchas so there must be something else (dodgy router/settings, ISP interference, red-flagged IP block etc). Unless OP's browser version has unusual settings (default or modified by someone).
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

16 Feb 2017, 18:17

I don't think this trouble has anything to do with Pale Moon or extensions. As I've mentioned the same problem happens if I connect with my wife's computer and that doesn't use extensions. Safe Mode doesn't help either. I suppose I could try an old version of Pale Moon (now using 64 bit 27.1.0) but since the only trouble I have is with this site I think it is the settings on the site that is causing the captcha to appear. I'm seeing it on the front page when I'm logged out with a clean cache and all cookies removed so I think it is possible that first-time visitors might be getting caught and never ever see the site. It also happens when I stay logged in which is personally more of a nuisance. What's the point of having double the number of cookies to other sites if they don't allow registered users who are logged in direct access?
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Drugwash
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

17 Feb 2017, 12:38

Do you ever mark the "Remember me" checkbox on the login page? If you don't you may get kicked out after a while.
But I never ever see any captcha even if I visit the front page - or any page on the autohotkey.com domain, for that matter - while not being logged in.
But then again I blocked google.com (and most affiliated domains as well) in my HOSTS file so that could make a difference. Or not.

So far you haven't done anything to try and find the problem or at least never mentioned it (sorry if my memory fails me).
- Try different browsers
- Connect one of the computers directly to the Internet, (temporarily) bypassing any router or other equipment you may have
- Try to log in from a friend's computer
- Take your (or your wife's) computer to a different Internet connection or ISP
- Take note of your external IP(s) for a certain period of time (a week or so) and contact the AHK admin with that information

Please try to perform the aforementioned operations if/when possible and report back with the results.
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

18 Feb 2017, 18:41

Thanks for the suggestions. Have the same issue with Internet Explorer. Had the same issue last year using a relative''s computer from a different ISP. Haven't tried that recently, though. How do I take note of my external IP(s)? Not sure how to do that. Thanks again. I might experiment with the HOSTS file but I suspect blocking google will mean I won't be able to see the website at all. For some reason my account seems to trip cloudflare which then demands the use of a google captcha to get through, and the number of questions I have to go through seems to be increasing.
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Drugwash
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

19 Feb 2017, 08:08

There are several online services that can show you your external IP, such as this one which also shows browser's User Agent and other browser settings.

If you had the same issue on a different computer connected to a different ISP then the logical conclusion would be that your AHK username/account particularly is the one triggering the "protection" (or whatever they may call it), which is indeed peculiar, because it doesn't seem to stand out in any way, at least not more than my own.

Personally I consider Google as The Enemy and I don't want to allow them around my computers. If something doesn't work without Google then I don't want that "something". Simple. But that's only my personal opinion and option.
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

21 Feb 2017, 00:06

Drugwash wrote:Personally I consider Google as The Enemy and I don't want to allow them around my computers. If something doesn't work without Google then I don't want that "something". Simple. But that's only my personal opinion and option.
I basically agree and if this were any other site I'd be long gone. About the only thing I can think of is setting up a brand new account and see if I get the same problems, but considering I can't get to the site if I am logged out I don't think it will work.
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

21 Feb 2017, 04:12

Not sure if related but right now the FlagFox extension shows me that autohotkey.com returns an IPv6-type address. There's a slight chance this kind of addresses are not correctly interpreted/translated somewhere along the way (for security certificates and things like that), which could be triggering some kind of protection. Unfortunately I have no expertise in this domain.
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

21 Feb 2017, 18:14

Thanks for taking the time with this. I just got straight through this morning, so I'm not consistently blocked out. Wish I could work out what is triggering the problem. Your thought about IPv6 is an interesting one but I know no expertise there either.
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

22 Feb 2017, 01:47

And now I see a "regular" IP for this domain. Could've been a glitch in my browser (I had just updated FlagFox before logging in last time) but it's also possible some service (CloudFlare or whatever gets in the middle) is randomly serving either IPv4 or IPv6 connections to clients.
You may wanna try FlagFox at least for a while, it may help in finding out if it's an IP problem or something else.

For now it's only happening to you as far as we know but it can always spread if it's not account/computer-related, so it's best if we find out the cause and the solution before that - people would then know what to do. Helping each-other is only human. :)
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

23 Feb 2017, 16:37

Thanks, I'll install FlagFox and see what I can find out.
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Drugwash
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

28 Feb 2017, 05:24

This link just came up in a topic nearby: why you shouldn't use Cloudflare.
The interesting part is at mid-page (towards the end of the post), where it says about captchas.
This may be your actual problem.
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

28 Feb 2017, 17:14

So the question arises as to why this website is using Cloudflare. It seems Cloudflare is forcing me to use Google in order to complete the captcha to get through to the site. The only place I've ever encountered Cloudflare is here. The only site I encounter constant captchas is this one. I really hope the site dumps Cloudflare.
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

28 Feb 2017, 17:21

We all connect through cloudflare. Only you and maybe a few others have a problem with captchas. I personally have never had a captcha prompt. This would suggest that cloudflare is not the problem.
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Drugwash
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

01 Mar 2017, 05:10

As mentioned on the page I've linked to above, Cloudflare may flag a certain block of IPs as 'bad' by incorrectly associating it with certain unwanted activity. As such, any innocent person that happens to be randomly given such IP by their ISP will be facing the captcha challenge whenever the flag is raised.

Personally I don't know any details as to how Cloudflare actually works in terms of filtering 'bad' IPs and whatnot, but the explanation offered on that site fits quite well the behaviour our original poster is experiencing. Bad luck - maybe his ISP has a bullseye on their "forehead". Yours (and mine and other people's) don't. But the user is not to blame, nor is the ISP - no Cloudflare would mean no erroneous filtering, all users would be happy.

But then again, people in charge at AHK must have had their reasons to use Cloudflare. Some DDoS attacks, if I recall correctly. So, what to do? Personally I don't know. :(

Oh and to be fair, it is just an assumption that Cloudflare would be the culprit, based on the similarity between the description on that page and the behavior experienced by the OP. Whether this is indeed the truth or the cause is different, we don't really know yet.

Bad thing is, not even testing by connecting through anonymous proxies for a while wouldn't work; I tried that some time ago for some other reason (on another site, not related to AHK) and I have been challenged with the captcha right away, probably because such proxies are already flagged as "dangerous" by default or they have already been used for malicious activities and thus got blacklisted.
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SOTE
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

02 Mar 2017, 05:28

I think the better policy is to not allow guests to post, just view content. I can't think of any good reasons why somebody interested in posting, wouldn't get an account. A good verification process to get an account should put any spammer on pause.

And if a person justs wants to view content, then they can remain a guest.

Hopefully this can allow for easing up on the Captcha. Because it's ridiculous, and doing multiple challenges to access the AutoHotkey website, making it odd and user unfriendly. I understand the motivation behind it, because when I was here a while back, I saw how ridiculous the spam attacks were. I'm just saying that perhaps there is a better way. Maybe no posting by guests might be it.
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

02 Mar 2017, 11:54

Guest posting has been discussed before multiple times. There were many good arguments on both side, but a final decision was made. Guest posting shall remain (other than maintenance or server issues).
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PuzzledGreatly
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Re: Google Captcha Terror

02 Mar 2017, 16:12

If the main reason for using Cloudflare is to allow guest posting then I think the decision needs to be revisited. How many people never get to see the AHK site because of cloudflare's captcha? Even a few is too many. It is incredibly offputting. Remember it blocks access to the whole site. I can't even view the site unless I go through the captcha. I've noticed that it is getting slower and slower. Multiple Images need to be clicked over and over and it's taking several seconds to display new images. As of this morning it's getting near a minute to get through and I'm logged in!. I'm sure Cloudflare is the culprit. Problems only started when it began to be used. Using Cloudflare seems to be a case of cutting one's nose to spite one's face. The page Drugwash linked to gave various reasons why using Cloudfare is bad. If even a couple of them are true there should be a community poll explaining the issue and asking whether users want cloudlare or not. Even if I weren't experiencing problems I wouldn't. Guest posting is a nice feature but not at the expense of privacy and accessibility to the site.

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